So much of this space has been collapsed into homogenized entertainment. Nowadays, by the time a child is ten years old they have seen every form of the hero’s journey in the cartoons they watch, to the degree where there are tropes and nods to source material or even sometimes derivatives of source. Sci fi, fantasy and other genres are blended in as hooks because cartoons have to keep viewership and eye balls, so they throw everything they can find at it.
As a result, unfortunately, there is very little “new” material. The old material that took centuries to develop and longer has been flattened and duplicated, over and over again. I sound like a curmudgeon (I probably am), but I stopped watching movies entirely not too long ago because it became a farce of seeing cliche writing. Shows are even worse so as to not even warrant discussing.
Cyberpunk specifically has also been outdated fast by real world developments, and other genres emerging with similar topics, but different design(?)-language. The whole cyberspace-element for example kinda died (or evolved) with the rise of the real internet, the Matrix-Movies and recently with stuff like VRMMO-stories from asia.
The overall concepts and elements are still around in some way, but the specific combination and language that makes cyberpunk are gone. At the end I would say they were a result of their time, and time has changed, so not it's just nostalgia and retro.
I'd go the other way and say Cyberpunk was meant to be capitalism taken to its logical extreme (unregulated industries rife with corruption, with markets/regimes perturbed only through acts of violence and espionage).
As life begins to imitate art, we're met with a The Thick Of It type situation where the satire of reality is no longer applicable and would be further diminished by continuing it
> "Time and again, The Thick of It led and reality fell in behind."
We do have some degree of it, but it's more on the realistic side of performance. The remaining body has to handle them after all, so it's hard to enhance performance beyond human limits for real. Maybe with some more decades of development.
But we've also learned that we don't need to change the body itself, when we can just enhance the tools we use. Smartphones are already seen as some sort of half-step towards humans becoming cyborgs. Similar have we now Exoskeletons, which are probably more practical than replacing a full limb.
I think you are right for movies and TV shows, but not for "comics, manga and graphic novels" and I'll add books as well. Since those are much cheaper and easier to produce than TV shows and movies, they can be created independently, without the need to optimize for earning tons of money. Indie literature and comics are very diverse in the storytelling.
But I acknowledged (and dread a bit) that the audiovisual storytelling is such a strong force that any discussion about storytelling, even when specifically talking about literature/comics storytelling, is dominated by audiovisual references. Any creative writing workshop/course that include sci fi and fantasy genres will inevitably mention Star Wars as example for whichever technique. The more literary ones will mention some Oscar winning movie, etc.
I've noticed this as well and I'm rather concerned about it. Those cheap rip offs will ruin countless classics for her and it's really sad. I'm looking for the most boring stuff for her to watch just so she doesn't become fully jaded by age 18.
Side note: if you need new stories, I've found a lot of weird and fun stuff to read on Royal Road.
I meant to write quite a long response to your comment, but let me just bring it down to a single question: How is your feeling different from melancholia?
There is and always will be mainstream, niche, the unknown and everything in between. There was always very little new material and a lot of works just gained recognition when their zeitgeist was long overdue, too. I think experimentation is hard, and it's even harder to justify experimentation in the evolving economic climate.
Genres are meant to be collapsed, or rather they should blend and dissolve into each other. The earlier (and good) seasons of The Simpsons are a poster child when it comes to "flattening and duplicating old material". Almost every episode cites a movie or work of literature, and there was nothing wrong with it! It's part of why I understand the 90s as a cultural era of citations, and I had to grow up with that sentiment. It took me quite some time to understand that we moved past it.
Nowadays, we are fortunate enough that a lot of things from the past 10 decades have been digitized and are readily available on demand. That's amazing! Nothing is stopping me from asking myself some naive questions, like "What makes a good drama?" or "If Die Hard is considered to be a Christmas movie, why isn't Falling Down considered to be a summer movie?". I think there is still stuff to explore.
I'll just leave this unfinished thought with a recommendation to a niche movie I discovered recently: Sleep Has Her House (2017)[0]
it’s been this way forever. the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, 00, etc… all had generic trash movies and music too.
stop getting recs from algorithms and the entire world will open back up to you. just like top40 music and generic movies from back in the day, you’re getting the lowest common denominator recs.
i read a book about the music industry in the 80s (it’s been a couple years and i can’t remember the name now) but people called the top40 music from back then formulaic. they were convinced record labels had formulas to make their pop music stars. what do you think algorithms are? they’re feeding you trash.
again, stop getting your recommendations from algorithms and the world will open back up. get your recs from actual film or music geeks. go to your local record store, look at their wall of employee recs, or *gasp* talk to them and ask them.
I abandoned movies too, 5 years ago or so. There's little space for "art" (whatever that might be) when you need to invest giant sums and expect a return. There's still some good movies coming out, I'm sure. But I don't have the time or energy anymore to dig for it like I did in the past.
While there’s a lot of slop out there that just exist to extract dollars, there are still some great movies being made every now and then. Don’t expect them to be the most popular high budget movies, you have to dig a little. The idea that there’s nothing new that’s worth watching though is clearly wrong and a typical bias that basically every person has to fight against as they age. You might even say it’s a cliche to think all new media is junk.
I don’t watch many movies due to time but those I do watch tend to be odd, unusual, experimental, and sometimes polarizing.
A recent one I enjoyed was Rabbit Trap, a modern take on faerie lore. It was polarizing and got poor reviews.
Years ago I adored a two season series called Hellier. I have a hard time describing this. Ghost hunting show for thinking people? You have to suspend disbelief but it reminded me of Primer in terms of a lot achieved on little budget. If you want to see some hipsters try to use transcranial magnetic stimulation to talk to aliens this is for you.
I’ve enjoyed some horror for its tendency to subvert tropes: hero to villain, villain is really hero, everybody dies, etc.
But yeah. I can only watch blockbusters if I’m in a certain kind of mood where I want light entertainment with no thought.
When society is affluent enough, people say it will become corrupt and fall apart. But when society has truly deteriorated, stories of heroes come to mind. If you look back at the era when cyberpunk social critiques emerged, the world that led that movement was wealthy, with a thick middle class. But when society starts to become poorer, those kinds of stories become stressful for the public. When you have room to breathe, such macro-level critiques serve as a 'healthy amount of stress' for survival. But when survival itself is at stake, it becomes much harder to be tolerant of criticism.
That's why the countries where cyberpunk flourished were wealthy ones
I’ve toyed around with this hypothesis about dark music and edgy culture.
The roaring 90s were full of this: dark music exploring critical themes or things like depression and addiction, lots of social criticism, and edgy offensive humor. The mid to late 90s were an economic boom time for a broader segment of people and were optimistic in a way that’s hard to explain today.
I like to put it this way: it’s not that things were all better in the 90s. They weren’t. But people thought they were getting better.
Now people don’t want those things. They want light entertainment, either no criticism (the right) or only approved types via approved critical theories (the left), and offensive edgy stuff is out and may get you cancelled (which side cancels you depends on the content).
It seems like we think alike. I feel like the dark and critical themes of the 90s were ahead of their time back then. A lot of what they predicted actually turned out to be accurate. The cultural media of the 90s said things like 'this is what will happen if wealth becomes concentrated or corporations take over'—and it's actually playing out in a similar way.
But as our society has become more stratified by wealth and the vast majority have become poorer, people no longer have the mental space to think deeply. They've come to love clear, simple answers.
I interpret this as the world becoming too excessive. Because there's so much information that it's hard to even find meaningful content. Critical interpretation has also become difficult. Just look at AI. It's different today and different tomorrow, and for freelancers like me, it's like we have to deliver immediately.
There's material poverty, but I think mental poverty is more due to the pervasive FOMO, the fear of falling behind in the flood of information
As you said, it's 'only approved types via approved critical theories.' As people lose their margin for error, they also lose the capacity to consider others' perspectives.
And yet. The other day I saw Dune described as this generation's LotR, which was that generation's Star Wars. Dune (and LotR, and SW) are all Hero's Journey stories (what isn't?), yet they're each pretty unique.
Granted, LotR and Dune were written in the 50's and 60's, respectively, with Star Wars following a decade later.
All I'm saying is that what is new depends on what generation you grow up in. And I suppose how much media you're exposed to. Speaking for myself, LotR was the second film I ever saw in the cinema so it was a whole new experience.
For the younger generations, these are old films, much like how idk, Spartacus and co was an old film for me.
tl;dr, the kids will be alright. Actually the kids also appreciate older media, there's a whole generation of late teenagers now rediscovering 2000's music / culture.
I'd also argue in LotR only Frodo has an archetypal Hero's Journey, but the novel itself is almost (but not quite) an ensemble piece with many other important characters that are not necessarily embarked on a steretypical Hero's Journey (Aragorn, Legolas & Gimli, Merry & Pippin, Gandalf).
Sidestepping the Hero's Journey for a second (which Dune actually subverts, one of its key points being that heroes are bad for mankind), Villeneuve's Dune is nowhere near a massive pop culture phenomenon of its time like Star Wars and LotR were of theirs, respectively.
Coincidentally, there is a new Ghost in the Shell anime that's premiering now on Amazon Prime Video. It's animation style and mood are closely aligned with the original 1989 manga, which is to say it's more cartoonish and light-hearted. I prefer the more adult oriented content the franchise was putting out up until about 2006, but the new anime series gives me hope that we might eventually see a follow-up animation of Shirow Masamune's Man/Machine Interface - what was once considered to be Ghost in the Shell 2 before Mamuro Oshii created Innocence.
Personally I think I'm done with GitS at this point. How many times has it been rebooted, like a dozen times?
The last one I enjoyed watching was Arise but I lost track after that. I think the series has been done to death and I would love to see some completely new IP from Masamune that is more reflective of the AI and economic upheavals we are experiencing in the 20s.
I see every version as a remix of the original material, each done with their own take and philosophy. They're not remakes or reboots.
The only version that didn't add anything new was the Hollywood movie, which was an entertaining but shallow derivative of Oshii's animes and not based on the manga at all.
I think the original material provides enough ideas to continue spinning off new remixes. It hasn't even been outdated by the recent advancements in AI. Quite the opposite.
I don't think it will be animated any time soon due to Major not having much screen time, but if you haven't seen it, I would definitely recommend Human Algorithm[1] manga. It's a bit different art style than the original, more gritty and sterile, in a good way. For me personally that makes it a bit more cyberpunk feel. The first arc is a bit drag at a time but when all plot lines converge, the payoff is awesome.
You're probably not going to get it. And he has decent reasons for not wanting to bother.
The nature (infamy?) of his activities over the past few years should also be noted. (And maybe chuckled at if you have a bit of a dark sense of humor.)
He's always been a very horny creator and the original Ghost In the Shell movie (in fairness not directed by him) has the female main character need to get nude to use her stealth ability while the men can leave their clothes on.
Whatever narrative you've invented of Shirow changing over time is a stretch.
If you've seen the original movie, other than nudity there is very little horny in it. No sex, no banter about sex, no erotica. The female body, even if well endowed, is depicted clinically and emotionless. There are no lecherous characters, nobody chasing girls, etc. No romance even, though the relationship between Motoko and Batou is somewhat ambiguous.
Shirow's manga is horny though, partly why I dislike it.
It's not corruption. He has stated that there were projects going on behind the scenes, but most of them got scrapped before reaching production.
The most recent manga he involved with was Ghost Urn, which explores the world of GitS from a different protagonist. He did not do the drawing, but did most of the worldbuilding and mecha design.
A lot of mangaka have done that sort of thing, calling something normal in the industry "infamous" and "corrupting" seems overblown when Tatsuya Matsuki and Nobuhiro Watsuki are grooming children and collecting CP and every other mangaka seems to be shitposting racism.
The article author sure likes Ghost in the Shell. Almost every variant is listed.
The article only covers comics, manga, and graphic novels, not anime. So Bubblegum Crisis, which is half cyberpunk and half music videos, isn't listed. Nor is Cowboy Bebop.
(The site is now intermittently down, with "429 Too many requests".)
Fans of Shirow will probably lynch me, but I didn't like the manga all that much. Not even the art style, which the new animé seems to replicate.
To me, Mamoru Oshii's 1995 GitS is THE version, because I'm seldom in the mood for slapstick and I much prefer the introspective mood of the movie, and its cinematic visuals. And the music!
I haven't liked any other adaptations since. To me, the movie is almost perfect. I didn't like Innocence much though.
I really like the art direction of the new GitS adaptation (I hope this retro style gets used more), but yeah it's completely different in tone from the '95 adaptation and most of what followed.
also go read my comic about a robot lady with reality issues, http://egypt.urnash.com/rita/, it's got cover quotes from three people with seven Hugos between them.
It might be skirting the edges of what is considered cyberpunk since it has Mecha elements but Patlabor is a fantastic manga/series that should have been included in this list [1]
It is especially strange not to see it in the list given GiTS is heavily featured (according to the comments, I can't access the page or web archive ATM).
Patlabor movie 2 was directed by the same director as the original 1995 GiTS animation movie. Both patlabor 1 / 2 have similar themes to GiTS, and are heavily cyber punk in themes and esthetics.
In Italy (and sometimes abroad, I recall dark horse translated it in English at some point) Nathan Never has been publishing as a monthly comic for a few decades.
This is a bit of an idiosyncratic list. Two of my favorite additions from my own youth: Hard Boiled by Frank Miller and Geof Darrow and Batman: Digital Justice. The latter now reads like a bit of a corny cash grab for the early '90s cyber fad, but I still love the time capsule of some if its art.
It took me twice as long to read Hard Boiled as it should since I spent so much time looking at Geof Darrow’s intricately detailed art. Great story, but the illustrations are on another level.
It's not that idiosyncratic a list, those were the first two graphic novels that came to my mind when opening up the website. Geoff Darrow's art Hardboiled is incredible. I was a huge batman fan as a young teen and digital justice came out at peak Batman hype, and it was much hyped itself, but it wasn't very good.
A recent (2023) finding: from Guillaume Singelin, Frontier [0]. Fitting it into "cyberpunk" may need a bit of a push, but since the limits are kind of blurry I don't really care. The narrative is not perfect perhaps falling into wanting to say a lot more than the page limit allows, but all in all it's a good enough read.
I'm vouching for Frontier as well, as well as "Carbon & Silicon" [0] from Mathieu Bablet. All of his work is gorgeous, I love his art.
If you liked Frontier's theme and are into video games I recommend you check out "Citizen Sleeper" [1] illustrated by Guillaume Singelin as well.
It's a 7 hour narrative text-based adventure that really hooked me one week-end. Your choices depend on how you "spend" your dice, dice that are cast at the beginning of every single day on the station so you get to pre-plan your actions somewhat.
Gameplay wise it's mostly reading, but I liked exploring the station they created.
I've honestly not ever considered Ghost in the shell to be under the cyberpunk genre. It's too clean and the characters too ingrained in the working of the system. And the system "works", it's not a sanitised depiction, gits society feels much like our own with a detailed techno-realism it's a society still at the transitional point to something more radical; exemplified by humans still doing very manual things - take for example that classic scene from the 1995 film, where the man uses multiple fingers to extremely fast into a terminal, this would seem impressive but pales in comparison to a direct cyberbrain connection, they still have terminals because this is a world still in transition. Another of my favourite but less known scenes is this scene from gitsac: https://paul.kishimoto.name/2017/01/barcodes/
But the point about the multi-finger fingers -xD- was not about transitional technology, but about explicitly avoiding direct brain connection as an additional layer of security.
Funny for some reason the submission title summoned this manga in my mind even though I've never read it only a free chapter in a magazine I was obsessed with.
I am somewhat surprised not to find any Jodorowsky in there.
Maybe the incal world doesnt really qualify as punk and more like regular scifi or perhaps bordeline new-agey, but it doesn’t strike me as fundamentally different from Akira in story style.
Rich Veitch, he and Alan Moore. As Moore would later write:
"The One ... is a kind of landmark; a pulling together of obsessions and ingenious storytelling ideas into a coherent whole ... Its revisionist superheroics, while conceived at roughly the same time, predate Watchmen and Dark Knight in terms of publication, as does its packaging. Its political and humanist preoccupations were voiced before such sentiments became chic. Its deranged, culture-conscious humor offers an alternative and an antidote to today's rather gloomy trend of pessimistic, post-modern ultra-humans... Whatever it is that the comic books of the 1980s turn out to be remembered for, The One was right there in the thick of it, carving out a niche in the mainstream for dangerous ideas long before dangerous ideas became box-office certainties."
as someone who loves Astro Boy (and everything else Tezuka made): Atom The Beginning was a disappointment. But I also believe that Pluto sucks too (some smaller stories, like the pianist, were great).
The Ghost In The Shell: Global Neural Network features one story by LRNZ. His work Geist Maschine (in italian only) is amazing.
Among the Cyberpunk 2077 comics, Big City Dreams is also very good.
The one I'd highlight from the list is Hiroki Endo's Eden: It's an Endless World, it's my favorite manga. It's beautifully drawn and incredibly grounded in tone and oddly relevant.
The overarching story is about a pandemic that starts as a backdrop and becomes more important and metaphysical and religious as the story goes on but the core of it revolves around crime bosses in Latin America, the lives of prostitutes, a Uyghur rebellion in Xinjiang, political conflict and organized crime all done in a very real way. It's completely devoid of any (manga) tropes or genre aesthetics.
As a result, unfortunately, there is very little “new” material. The old material that took centuries to develop and longer has been flattened and duplicated, over and over again. I sound like a curmudgeon (I probably am), but I stopped watching movies entirely not too long ago because it became a farce of seeing cliche writing. Shows are even worse so as to not even warrant discussing.
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